Ask HN: 如何判断 MuseScore 是骗子还是单纯的蠢货？
1 分•作者: clan•8 个月前
NETS[0] 已经阻止了 MuseScore 的信用卡支付。他们不仅仅是一家支付服务提供商（PSP），还是北欧地区许多银行的信用卡发卡机构。所以最简单的答案应该是：骗子——滚远点。但事情比这复杂得多。
我爱人是一位音乐家和音乐老师（就像他们所有人一样！），她想续订她的订阅。她给我们的银行打了电话，他们告诉她这笔交易被标记为欺诈。他们通常可以针对特定交易进行个别解禁，但这次不行，因为这是一个“硬性”封锁。他们无能为力。她的一位朋友告诉她，昨天她也遇到了同样的问题。
MuseScore 之前已经分拆成 MuseScore Studio（FOSS GPL2 乐谱软件）和 MuseScore Hub（商业社区部分）。我喜欢这样。但 FOSS 项目在下载页面[1]上大力推广 Hub，并有一个大的“行动号召”，写着“立即加入 musescore”。此外，Hub 对我的爱人来说是一个足够好的产品，她也愿意掏钱。
我们是通过一位名叫 Martin Keary (@Tantacrul)[2] 的聪明人了解到 MusecScore 的，你们中的许多人可能已经知道了。自从我们第一次看到他的视频以来，他已经加入了 Muse，担任软件主管[3]。他似乎做得很好。干得好。但有些事情严重不对劲。
一年前，他们似乎也遇到了同样的问题，银行将他们标记为欺诈[4]，而且在 Reddit 上很容易找到批评者 [5][6][7]。即使在 HackerNews[8] 上，他们也没有展现出高尚的道德标准。
所以我的猜测是，他们在订阅方面过于激进，因此收到了太多的拒付。但这纯粹是猜测，可能比这更恶劣。他们确实提供了有价值的服务，所以我怀疑他们不是传统意义上的骗子。但他们有这么多黑暗模式，以至于他们被_反复_封禁，这让我得出了一个非常严厉的判断：白痴。
当你查看 musescore.com 或 musescore.org 时，它们完全是干净的企业风格。没有提及投诉，没有忏悔。没有承认。如果你是无辜的，却被不公平地封禁，你会把这件事放在新闻部分的显眼位置。这看起来好吗？不——但这比第三方告诉全世界你因为欺诈而被封禁要好。
mehlmao[8] 站在了道德制高点上，我同意 mandatum[8] 他们的工作方式令人厌恶。另一方面，MuseScore 确实是一个非常好的产品，并且在很多方面是市场上最好的，具有巨大的发展势头。
作为一个合格的极客，我“只是”可以编写我自己的 Hub 软件并集成它。你知道的，一个周末项目。嘿，凭借一点商业头脑，我可以抢走他们的生意并赚一笔钱。他们可能不喜欢紧密的整合，并告诉我“滚开”。哎呀。我没有完成这项工作的能力，我只会造成恶意破坏。
相反，我将骑上高头大马，干脆不用它们。很好，但没有好的选择。所以我稍微下来一点，说重要的软件是开源的，因此它本身就很好。但我的爱人会打我，告诉我 Hub 对她的工作非常重要。以至于她自己已经调查了其他支付方式（PayPal 等），以应对这些假定的骗子！！！现实生活很残酷。
那么，我如何确定他们是否是真正的骗子，我应该战斗并说服她去别处看看？去哪里？我是否敢于简单地得出结论，他们只是白痴，并接受风险？等待并看看禁令是否解除，然后放弃所有担忧。继续生活。
你有什么替代方案吗？你如何影响一个正在走上错误道路的重要项目？你的立场是什么？
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NETS[0] has blocked credit card payments for MuseScore. They are not just a PSP but the card issuer for a lot of banks in the Nordics. So the easy answer should be: Fraudsters - stay away. But things are more complicated than that.<p>My SO is a musician and music teacher (as they all are!) and she wants to renew her subscription. She called our bank and they told her it was flagged for fraud. They can normally do an individual lift on specific transactions but not in this case as it was a "hard" ban. Nothing they could do. One of her friends told her that she had the same problems yesterday.<p>MuseScore has previously split up into MuseScore Studio (the FOSS GPL2 music notation software) and MuseScore Hub (the commercial community part). I like that. But the FOSS project pushes the Hub hard on the download page[1] with a big "call to action" saying "join musescore now". Furthermore the Hub is a good (enough) product for my SO and she is willing to fork out the money.<p>We found MusecScore via a bright fellow named Martin Keary (@Tantacrul)[2] which many of you proabably already know. Since we first saw his videos he has since joined Muse as Head of Software[3]. He seems to do really great things. Bravo. But something is seriously off.<p>A year ago they seemed to have the same problems with banks marking them as fraudulent[4] and it is not hard to find detractors on reddit [5][6][7]. Even here on HackerNews[8] they do not shine in the light of high moral standards.<p>So my guess is that they are too aggressive on the subscriptions and hence see too many chargebacks. But that is pure speculation and it might be more nefarious than that. They do actually provide a valuable service so I suspect they are not fraudsters in the traditional sense. But having so many dark patterns that it gets them banned _repeatedly_ makes me come to the very harsh judgement: Idiots.<p>When you look at either musescore.com or musescore.org they are completely squeaky clean coorporate style. No mentioning of complaints, no mea culpas. No acknowledgements. If you are innocent and gets unfairly banned you would put that front and center in your news section. Does it look good? No - but it is better than 3rd parties telling the world you are banned for fraud.<p>mehlmao[8] took the high moral ground and I agree with mandatum[8] that they work in distateful ways. On the other hand MuseScore is a really good product and in many ways the best on the market with a huge momentum.<p>As a proper nerd I could "just" write my own Hub software and integrate it. You know; a weekend project. Hey, with a little business savvy I could eat their lunch and make a buck. They might not enjoy tight integration and tell me to "fork off". Oops. I have no ballast for completing such an endeveour and I would only cause what ends up as malicious disruption.<p>Instead I will climb a high horse and simply not use them. Great, but there are no good options. So I'll climb a little down and say the important software is open source and hence good on its own. But my SO will clobber me and tell me the Hub is really important to her work. To such a degree that she on her own already have investigated other payment options (PayPal etc.) for the presumed fraudsters!!! Real life hits hard.<p>So how do I determine if they are real fraudsters and I should take the fight and convince her to look elsewhere? And where? Do I dare to simply conclude they are just idiots and accept the risk? Wait and see if the ban is lifted and just let go of all worries. Move on with life.<p>Do you have any alternatives? How do you impact an important project which is on a really bad path? What is your stance?